My Angst

I read this on another forum, and I wanted to reply... but I could not cause I knew everyone would flip out about it. So here is what I wanted to say...

"Yes the 3054xs TLB is nice. The larger hyd. pump, new hyd steering and relocation of the shifter were all good ideas,but what really got me excited was the industrial design of the loader and hoe. Kioti doesn't have any good pictures on its site of the well made subfram and single handle hoe attachment. About the price i'll tell you list is 24ish, call your local dealer and see if he has one. I think you will really like the way it fills and handles. "

I quickly noticed the old 2 stage dry clutch, the clutch driven shuttle, a maximum 1 remote, 24.5 PTO Hp, and just 10gpm of total hydraulic flow. There is not a chance in the world this tractor will handle like a modern TLB. Its clearly a very old design that was not made for the american market. Not to say that no one will find this a useful piece... but it just does not fit. The Kubota B21 has 90% of the ratted backhoe capacity but does it with 21HP, will price about the same, and has a HST tranny to boot.

My point is not to knock the brand and talk down about their stuff, or to try and compare these two models. My frustration is with people who are so brand loyal that they don't take the time to look at how that machine fits in with the competition or to see if it fits the needs of the user. Its so very pronounced in the Kioti forum at TBN that I am concerned about the misinfomation that people are relying on. Does anyone else feel this way, or is it just my bluish orange bias showing?  

   

as I see it, this is cyclical.. For a while there, no one had a right to life if they didn't own a Kubota, Then last year, early I think, it was John Deere's turn.. Kioti, Mahindra, Power trac, new Holland and all the rest of them all seem to have the guys get on the band wagon so to speak.. The die hards mention one thing and the next thing you know, a hundred of them harp the same thing,, I wouldn't let it throw you as I believe it is human nature,, Before you know it, it may be the Chinese made next,, time will tell

Yep.  It's amazing how much brand bashing there is over there.  I've got a little over 800 posts on that site and I don't recall ever posting anything brand specific in any of the Buying/Pricing sections other than to request the posted provide more information on the uses for the machine just to get a better feel for the size tractor needed.  I have never recommended a color.  My tractor is green (am I allowed to say that here? ) but when I add or replace, I'll look at all of the big 3 with no initial bias or preference on any brand.

the real sad part of this is, the guy doing the bashing, (deere or nothing) and making fun of Kioti because it comes from S.Korea probably doesn't realize or better, doesn't want to hear and believe his 5500 series is also mostly foreign made parts,, More money for a machine does not translate into it has to be a better machine,,,

I couldnt agree more with you guys!  I think we all have our favorites (brands), and lets face it, if the prices were identical for the features, then we'd probably stay with a particular brand so we wouldnt need any new/special tools every few years---or at least not as many!  The real problem I had with that other site is there was a ton of smoke-screening and not much pertinant information.  I think people should be told the answer THEY are looking for, whether good or bad.  And as always, make it as short and sweet as possible!  All I want to close with is Im really glad Kiotijohn told me about this site.  I have had some contact with good people here because of it, and hope to keep the relationships going.  Thanks.

I believe for most as in my case, tractor buying is determined by price first, then needs.. Most people that I know, have to fall within a certain budget, be it the downpayment, the monthly payments, a cash sale or whatever,, Once this is determined, then they zero in on what tractor and it's features will suit best.. I had a Mahindra prior to the L 48 and have to say, the Mahindra's Bradco 511 backhoe is as good and in one little instance, is better than Kubota's 11 ftr on the 48.. Both machines for size, and ergonomic fit are equal. Loaders are not, not even close.. The KMW that comes on Mahindra's are terrible at best, Old design, small pistons, questionable specs as far as lift/use. I use hoes a lot,, I wanted the 48 three years ago and couldn't come close to obtaining one.. Got the Mahindra instead,.. The major reason for the 48, is simply the roll around seat,, To climb on and off, on and off continuously on the Mahindra was time consuming and actually hurting me health wise. So, when the opportunity presented its self, I made the change. Transmissions aren't a big factor with me.. The hydrostatic is nice,, I can still live with a manual too. The 4 post ROPS is superb,, The 48 loader is awesome,, The hoe does what I want. Size is the same and believe it or not the weights (as both machines were spec'd) aren't that much different.. Cost is just over a third difference..Unless you buy here in New England then the cost is double matching the two,, For a third more, I received a powerful FEL, roll around seat feature, 4 post ROPS, hydrostatic trans, a great name in compact tractors, better designed quick attach hoe bucket features,, Both are great machines.. Both will do what I want done. One, the FEL will take 5 times longer, but, it will get done.. Ironically, both machines are foreign made,,

LarryRB wrote:

I believe for most as in my case, tractor buying is determined by price first, then needs.. Most people that I know, have to fall within a certain budget, be it the downpayment, the monthly payments, a cash sale or whatever

Well, my mother always told me I was "unique"..
Here's another case where I do it the opposite.  I identify the needs first then try to work something in to meet those needs.  Don't get me wrong, if my wallet is bigger than my needs, you can plan on me getting something even bigger still.  I feel like "Tim the Toolman"

I thought it over after written and sent, and actually I guess we all should know the minimum needs we have, and go from there,, I think of all the people in my area, the prices are so high that they get in the way first of needs and common sense thinking. I was reading elsewhere, some complaining again about Kubota and NH's internet policy to dealers,, They really, REALLY, are making fatal mistakes,, The dealers in my area are going to keep forcing their list plus and still cry, (we don't sell very much) and in not too long a period from now, another year, maybe two, and the big three will lose all of New England area to Mahindra/Kioti and others,,, Then what will the war cry be.. It starts at corporate headquarters and flows down hill.

I don't think its a great idea either... but everyone is going that direction. You hear most about NH and Kubota because of me... but I think pretty well everyone is taking a simular stance. Its all preasure from those dealers thats causing this to happen. Long term I don't think its in their best interest either, not so much because of the pricing policy because the dealer selling at a $300 margin is the only one that will be noticed. (Thats what was happening before) Rather the problem is the stigma that it creates towards the brand. As you might have noticed this site was asked to remove the Kubota 2005 pictures, for good reason. However it does detract from the hype and free marketing that we where doing for them. Ya got me...

this was happeneing long before you joined any of these nets, so, you can't say it is because of you, at least totally.. as I told you before, my in-laws started with Chrysler in 49.. they couldn't give away vehicles, then they started with low pricing and equally low trade values,, within a few short years they averaged 1 Dodge pick up sold each day, about 2 or 3 cars a week, They could never change this all the way up to 99 when they got out of it,, the city type dealers up to 2000, were getting sticker plus or just shy of sticker.. now the ones surviving here, are doing what the in-laws figured out almost 50 years ago.. We are in  the last "green valley" of New England,, only 650 or so population in my town,, the surrounding towns are huge in comparison with up to 2000 population,,, The guy who has their dealership now, is losing because of that city attitude, doesn't understand one sale at 200 grand each vs ten sales at 400 each,, but he cries what a big mistake he made.. the tractor dealers here, are the same only they want much more in profit, therefore, their sales are extremely weak at best,, as far as your posting pictures I wonder about that too,, it is OK for Deen to post anything and nothing is said.. that in its self should tell you something

My fault, I ment to say that you hear about this the most from me because I talk about it in terms of whats happening. I am not the cause of it by a long shot, I do my best not to rock the boat. My bad, I can see how you read it that way.

What deen has posted is just marketing literature. My stuff was an issue because it was actual preproduction equipment thats somewhat different from what will actually be released. I'll post new pictures as the new models start to roll in for actual sale.

Gosh its busy! You would think that people only buy tractors during the last week of the fiscal year!